if there's one message from the jhana posting it's that ppl don't necessarily want endless bliss i still wonder if there's minimum viable suffering for survival maxxing imo ppl who use suffering as a frame are ppl who've really suffered a lot, like selection bias?
like how i think factory farmed animals suffer enough that their nonexistence would be net positive but otoh have the opposite prior for wild animals- that their lives are net positive n i assume a world without them is net negative